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 Post subject: Thinking the unthinkable / At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 4:58 pm 
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Reluctant as we are to enter the loathsome cockpit of parochial politics, it is interesting to note that Iain Martin in today’s Telegraph suggests that Mr Brown’s government is disintegrating. That much is self-evident and has been true for a long time. But it is also true that British government in general has been disintegrating for some time, even before that charlatan Blair parked his rump in Downing Street. That looming presence in Brussels had a great deal to do with that – its primary objective being to undermine national governments.

View full article here

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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 6:17 pm 
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Quote:
I am the man in the red hat.

I hope that's not Mr Aitken's sword of truth you're wearing....

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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 6:18 pm 
It is surprising how many people say they are thinking of voting BNP.Life long Conservatives and Labour supporters.Labeling the BNP,"far right" isn't going to deter those disenchanted with the left and will make no difference to those of the hard left.
What chance a British Place de la Concorde becoming the new Celebrity Big Brother amusement?


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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 6:18 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2006 6:06 pm
Posts: 356
The economic depression, and that's what it is, is just getting started. Government actions have guaranteed that it will be long and painful. I seriously doubt the EU will survive it, whether the main UK political parties recognize that reality or not. If Cameron were to state, unequivically, that he planned to lead Britain out of the EU, the Conservatives would sweep to victory and the growing BNP presence would be crushed. Unfortunately, I don't believe he's got it in him.

Here in the US, the Republicans have yet to decide how they should proceed. It seems clear to me, however, that it's only a matter of time before the anti-Obama emerges, a populist capable of soaring rhetoric and with millions of devoted adherents. We saw some of that with Palin, the mobbed speeches and teary-eyed female followers (I saw it myself at a Palin rally here in Nevada were 12,000 people showed up at a stadium which held only 3500). Joe the Plumber and Rick Santelli's Chicago Tea Party foreshadow what will come.

The bottom line is that this is not a time for the quiet politics-as-usual. Obama is but the first of the strong populists to emerge. There will be many more.


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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:11 pm 
It wasn't "the one subject of immigration tops the polls as the issue about which people feel most strongly"

Immigration was merely top of the issues from a YouGov compiled list offered to them. The economy was not in the running as it wasn't on the list! (See UK Polling Report and Political Betting)


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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 9:35 pm 
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christina Speight wrote:
It wasn't "the one subject of immigration tops the polls as the issue about which people feel most strongly"

Immigration was merely top of the issues from a YouGov compiled list offered to them. The economy was not in the running as it wasn't on the list! (See UK Polling Report and Political Betting)


Fair comment ... it's all in the questions ... ask the right questions and you get the answers you want!

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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 1:04 am 
If the BNP ever get anywhere near a serious electoral victory the state will simply ban them to avert the return of Nazism.


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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:56 am 
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Can they ban a legal political party?

Probably yes, they banned the smoking of a legal product almost everywhere. PDT_Armataz_01_35

The term legal has different interpretations for this ramshackle bunch of shysters.


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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 3:22 am 
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rosie wrote:
Can they ban a legal political party?


They'll find a way ...

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 Post subject: Re: At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:23 am 
Guest wrote:
If the BNP ever get anywhere near a serious electoral victory the state will simply ban them to avert the return of Nazism.


We already have it. Just about everything is already vetted by the State. What flavour of Fascism we ultimately get doesn't matter. One does need to understand that varients of 'far left' idealogy; Communism, Marxism, National Socialism are all really just Fascism.

To avoid; Communism, Fascism, Nazism, Marxism, Pol Pot, etc, we need to advocate individual freedom and self determination, subordination of the state as the servant of the individual.


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 Post subject: Re: Thinking the unthinkable / At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:41 am 

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am
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Quote:
subordination of the state as the servant of the individual.

More accurately the servant of society. What needs to be understood is that society is what we make it. If we wish to ignore our responsibilities and just demand our rights, like a schoolgirl mum, then it's not surprizing we end up with a nanny state. Giving the vote to those that don't provide for themselves and those around them was always going to bias politics to the gimme,gimme,gimme.

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 Post subject: Re: Thinking the unthinkable / At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:38 pm 
"If the BNP ever get anywhere near a serious electoral victory the state will simply ban them to avert the return of Nazism."

Which is in itself,a manifestation of Nazism,only this lot are InterNazis,the same as the Nazis but with delusions of grandeur.


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 Post subject: Re: Thinking the unthinkable / At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:46 pm 
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Peter wrote:
"If the BNP ever get anywhere near a serious electoral victory the state will simply ban them to avert the return of Nazism."

Which is in itself,a manifestation of Nazism,only this lot are InterNazis,the same as the Nazis but with delusions of grandeur.


Be careful about throwing the word "Nazi" around. It does not help understand what is going on, and neither does it reflect well on the users. There is something much more subtle going on - BNP is a reaction to it, but it does not solve a problem ... in many ways, it is simply a howl of rage. The bigger problem is that the "ruling classes" have lost touch with reality and have forgotten what they are there to do. They need reminding, but I'm not sure that slinging round Nazi epithets in any way moves us forward.

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 Post subject: Re: Thinking the unthinkable / At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:31 pm 
I speak with some authority with regard to the working class, I am a fully paid up member of some 55 years.

The Labour brothers have survived on the back of ignorance, loyalty, apathy, and fear of the unknown. however with the availabilty of the internet to the world and its wife, the disemination of news and information, and the speed with which it is gathered and shared has become a problem to our politcians.
Not that long ago it was fairly easy to keep out of the public domain, news which would upset the grate unwashed.
So to the matter of unfettered mass imigration; good for the country the luvvies told me and my kind, the trade unions were conspicues only by thier undignified silence. And in the middle of a reccesion you would expect the unions to speak up against any threat to the pay and conditions of its members. Silence is all they seem to offer on the subject of immigration and how it depresses pay and employment levels.

And the luvvies, well white working class man is inherently racist, so his views are unrepresentative at best ,and dispicable at worst.
It would seem that we have been betrayed by the university graduates wearing the labour colours, but hey we have always been undersold by those who think they know what is good for us.

The problem for the politicians, is that this time we know we have been well and truly conned
Enter the BNP, ready to grab a market deserted by the university educated, priviledged, social engineering elite, who have no experience of the life lived by white working man.


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 Post subject: Re: Thinking the unthinkable / At the end of the road …
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:40 pm 
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It is not by any means just the working class that feels deserted and betrayed ... the "ruling classes" have lost the plot across the board. It would not surprise me if a very signifcant number of middle-class people voted for BNP - not because they approve of that party but simply for the message it sends.

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