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 Post subject: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 3:13 pm 
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Norman Tebbit thinks it is time for the euro-sceptics of all kinds to design the architecture of a European home in which there is a place for states seeking ever closer union as well as for those upholding national sovereignty.

View full article here

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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 5:02 pm 

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Love the picture..
Please sir, Can I PLEASE be allowed to press the button...Please Sir, can I? Can I Sir.......Pleeeease.... :) PDT_Armataz_01_22

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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 5:05 pm 

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am
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I hope you block off the sewers before you do that.

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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 8:19 pm 
Now that's a building that really does need the Timothy McVeigh treatment. But the upgrade nuke-in-a-truck version, as you correctly envisage — to obviate the need for parking in the immediate vicinity since I'm sure the scum must be nervous enough by now to have that severely restricted.

I'm going to savour that thought for while.


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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 9:34 pm 
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I think CLM might have the answer.

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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:29 pm 
RAENORTH wrote:
I think CLM might have the answer.
Absolutley no doubt about it. He's just the man for the job. :lol:

He could "fancy it up" a little with a robot Slim Pickens waving his hat and yee-hawing through a giga-megaphone while riding the bomb all the way down so that the whole of phcking Europe heard it.

Bliss. :lol:


By the way, there was a great quotation from Churchill posted by William Shaw (October 28, 2008 1:11 AM) in the comments to the article by Lord Tebbit that you linked to.

Churchill wrote:
We [Britain] are bound to further every honest and practical step which the nations of Europe may make to reduce the barriers which divide them and to nourish their common interests and their common welfare. We rejoice at every diminution of the internal tariffs and martial armaments of Europe. We see nothing but good and hope in a richer, freer, more contented European commonality.

But we have our own dream and our own task. We are linked, but not comprised. We are interested and associated, but not absorbed. And should European statesman address us in words which were used of old, ‘Wouldest thou be spoken for to the king, or the captain of the host?' we should reply, with the Shunammite woman: ‘I dwell among mine own people.’”


"I dwell among mine own people."


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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 2:54 am 
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The europhile to whom you refer, also got the date wrong. This was from an article in the New York Saturday Evening Post on 13 February 1930. It continues:

"We must build a kind of United States of Europe. Great Britain, the British Commonwealth of Nations, mighty America must be the friends and sponsors of the new Europe".

The article was in response to the Briand Memorandum which had been circulated and which was formally published on 20 May 1930, this coinciding with the evacuation of French troops from the German Rhineland.

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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 12:55 pm 
RAENORTH wrote:
The europhile to whom you refer...
Oh! Given the Churchill quotation he selected, I'm surprised he's a europhile but I wouldn't know William Shaw from Adam. It strikes me he shot himself in the foot then. Or have I got the wrong end of the stick?

As for Churchill expressing a wish to "build a kind of United States of Europe" and the rest of what he said in that direction I treat it in the same way I do Rutherford's dismissal of the use of the energy bound up in the atom. I don't require perfection from my heroes. It was OK for WSC to want to "dwell among mine own people" but the Germans and French wouldn't feel the same? He was obviously having a 'fluffy' moment. :)

But maybe he had a loose federation in mind? On the other hand he must have been aware of even the US Federal Government's centralising tendencies. With those fleeting thoughts and contradictions buzzing around in my head I gave up with that part of his dream, a united Europe, which is of no interest to me anyway. My attention was attracted only by his desire to have his dwelling properly sited.

Similarly with Norman Tebbit. Given his position, I wondered if that is as far as he can 'reasonably' go — UK out, but fluffy best wishes to our neighbours. By his position, I mean that maybe within the current tory set-up he's angling for the 100lb fish of UK withdrawal with a 2lb line. There seems little point in him blowing whatever influence he has in his party by giving the europhiliacs the opportunity to brand him as being beyond the pale, a relic, an anachronism from the days of old from which we have all now "moved on". (Christ, how I detest that mealy-mouthed expression.)

One thing that struck me as odd was that these statements
Norman Tebbit wrote:
The retreat of countries within the eurozone into unilateral protectionism to save their own banks has illuminated the fatal weakness of the euro. It is a currency with 15 finance ministers - and no currency can survive in the long term without not only a single central bank, but a single Treasury, a single finance minister and a single tax system.
...

The financial crisis has exposed that the present system of monetary union without political union is unsustainable...
were not followed immediately by: "However, all this was plain textbook stuff right at the outset. This should be a surprise to no one. But the fact that it appears to be a surprise to some (most?) simply demonstrates the success the europhiles had in keeping the public distracted with mundane transactional considerations and similar froth while keeping them thoroughly misinformed on the all-important fundamentals with the deliberate intention of using the euro as a Trojan Horse to force a one-government Europe. Bastards. I hope it phcking kills them now." But toned down a bit maybe.

One gets the impression from him that people are waking up to it only now*. THAT is very misleading. But again, for a man in his position, is it as far as he can 'reasonably' go?

What would I do in his position? I cannot say I wouldn't do the same.



* P.S. Unlikely—but one never knows—perhaps he's only just woken up to it himself?


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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:36 pm 

Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 3:27 pm
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Location: Oxford, UK
Quote:
"moved on". (Christ, how I detest that mealy-mouthed expression.)


Me too, but it is useful as a trigger for a BS alarm. Whenever you hear it, you KNOW that somebody has something to cover up. And you know that this is the time to keep digging/agitating to get to the truth.


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 Post subject: Re: Redesigning the architecture
PostPosted: Thu Oct 30, 2008 2:12 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2006 2:47 am
Posts: 150
Uh, but it might contribute to global warming.


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