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 Post subject: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:50 pm 
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Major changes to surveillance laws are to give the government the power to monitor email exchanges and website visits of every person in the UK, says the Daily Wail and others.

The new legislation, we are told by the Wail, is expected to be announced in the Queen's Speech next month, despite similar "Big Brother"-style laws being rejected six years ago. Internet companies will be instructed to install hardware enabling GCHQ - the government's electronic "listening" agency - to examine "on demand" any phone call made, text message and email sent, and website accessed in "real time".

View full article here

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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:29 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 10:36 pm
Posts: 93
Location: Edinburgh
RAENORTH wrote:
Does anyone believe that, with data retention being an occupied field, the British government is working entirely independently, and has not consulted with the commission on this?



Betcha, John Redwood would try to make that case.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:24 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 3:12 pm
Posts: 1441
Independent? - Not anymore mate!

But the EU don't want you to know....

Quote:
with grateful thanks to bigmach - I am faithfully copying his eye opening blog post on CBs DT piece 310312.

17 hours ago

You will be familiar with the Foreign Office papers released under the thirty year rule, FCO 30/1048. In these we read,

"

Disinformation

After entry there would be a major responsibility on HMG and on
all political parties not to exacerbate public concern by attributing unpopular
measures or unfavourable economic developments to the remote and unmanageable workings of the Community.



Transfer of the Executive

24 (ii) The transfer of major executive responsibilities to the bureaucratic Commission in Brussels will exacerbate popular feeling of alienation from government.


If that ain't black and white enough for yer - then either you work for Brussels or are a complete and utter purblind ninny.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:24 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 2:03 pm
Posts: 437
The most brilliant businessman I ever knew never, never, never, communicated by email or computers. Not from the day it started until now.

He's very careful about phones too; workplaces keep their own bugs in place. Outside work: he has good friends in high places.

As for snail mail ... we can but hope to keep it a little free; but, as I say, the international stuff goes through Germany.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:30 am 
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Ravenscar wrote:
If that ain't black and white enough for yer - then either you work for Brussels or are a complete and utter purblind ninny.

Ravenscar,

Thanks for that.

Apparently a 136MB pdf of FCO/301048 is available for download at Albert Burgess - A Case for Treason.

Here's the direct link to it: http://www.acasefortreason.org.uk/image ... 301048.pdf

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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:53 am 

Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2010 8:08 pm
Posts: 295
The EU, our bureaucrats and progress... mildly OT but as evidence of attitude - priceless.

If a smidgin of autonomy or devolved initiative were offered to our public servants - do you think for a moment that they'd embrace it and use some sense? It would seem that they are positively averse to the idea. The focus is entirely on extending arbitrary powers for the executive whilst attributing their make it up as you go / change the rules after the game antics to a remote and unaccountable authority - something that our public servants have developed a real appetite for...

Is the naming of UK government departments deliberately ironic?

If this wholesale snooper charter isn't an EU initiative, it was presented to Cameron's clown troupe perfectly formed - only requiring a few drops of Holy Water / rubber stamp. I'd bet local councils and community safety partnerships are "stakeholders" in this enterprise - yes, I can see a whole new world of council worker job descriptions coming down the gobbledegook line.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:43 am 
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Location: Burton upon Trent
Hasn't Microsoft Windows had trap doors built into it's software for years for that very purpose?


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:00 am 
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Location: Police State
It's obviously a coincidence Richard…

I am pretty sure that His Cameronness was very much against the proposed legislation of the then Labour government, he wouldn't have been posturing then… I don't think that's Cameron's way…

Indeed as an example of this, he has been speaking today on the anniversary of the Falkland Islands invasion, about his guarantee that the UK is committed to protecting their sovereignty.

Quote:
Britain remains "staunchly committed to upholding the right of the Falkland Islanders, and of the Falkland Islanders alone, to determine their own future," and
"That was the fundamental principle that was at stake thirty years ago: and that is the principle which we solemnly re-affirm today,"


If I were an inhabitant of that far off place, I would be brushing up on my Spanish right now.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:10 am 
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If the EU law is a directive, I thought they directly applied in the member states without the need for transposition? So the EU legislation should already be law. Unless HMG is going above the directive in effectiveness, there would be no need for HMG to legislate. The waters are certainly muddy.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:24 am 
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Stuart wrote:
If the EU law is a directive, I thought they directly applied in the member states without the need for transposition? So the EU legislation should already be law. Unless HMG is going above the directive in effectiveness, there would be no need for HMG to legislate. The waters are certainly muddy.

As I understand it Stuart, it is the directives that can be "goldplated" via the Westminster town hall, rather than regulations and decisions, which are implicit.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 8:59 am 
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Stuart wrote:
If the EU law is a directive, I thought they directly applied in the member states without the need for transposition? So the EU legislation should already be law. Unless HMG is going above the directive in effectiveness, there would be no need for HMG to legislate. The waters are certainly muddy.


No ... 'tis the other way round. Directives require transposition. EU regulations have direct effect.

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We are a satellite state of the Greater European Empire, ruled by a supreme government in Brussels. We owe this government neither loyalty nor obedience. It is not our government. It is theirs. It is our enemy.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:25 am 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 12:15 am
Posts: 1315
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Ravenscar wrote:
Independent? - Not anymore mate!

But the EU don't want you to know....

Quote:
with grateful thanks to bigmach - I am faithfully copying his eye opening blog post on CBs DT piece 310312.

17 hours ago

You will be familiar with the Foreign Office papers released under the thirty year rule, FCO 30/1048. In these we read,

"

Disinformation

After entry there would be a major responsibility on HMG and on
all political parties not to exacerbate public concern by attributing unpopular
measures or unfavourable economic developments to the remote and unmanageable workings of the Community.



Transfer of the Executive

24 (ii) The transfer of major executive responsibilities to the bureaucratic Commission in Brussels will exacerbate popular feeling of alienation from government.


If that ain't black and white enough for yer - then either you work for Brussels or are a complete and utter purblind ninny.


you have it the wrong way round! The EU doesn't write the FCO's papers for it! :) It's the British government/bureaucracy that doesn't want to let people know about its own complicity in the project!

How many of the tens of thousands of EU decisions have ever been formally opposed by a British minister in the EU Council of Ministers? I would guess at a count on one hand, or less.

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"It is amazing the number of highly intelligent persons in the world who make no contribution at all to the well-being of their fellow men" - Lee Kuan Yew


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:30 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 11:28 am
Posts: 805
I have to admire the wording of the press release:

Quote:
to increase users' control of their data and to cut costs for businesses


Definitely CE-marked doublespeak.

Please add to the the Old Swan Manifesto a demand that English Law takes precedence over other law.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:50 am 

Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:56 am
Posts: 97
While the EU Soviet bureaucracy is certainly behind many of our police state advances, I would imagine that, due to the enormous criminality of such intrusive and abusive legislation, justified by a war on terror story that only very few people believe any more, hostage states are given leeway, time in which to place the jackboot of state onto the faces of the opressed peoples.

The process is global. Here is OZ

http://www.zengardner.com/pine-gap-and- ... ian-quake/

America is out of sight, so far are they down the road to state totaltarian power.

Kiwis on the same road too.

But the MSM are paying a price for their unquestioning obedience of the Bankster agenda:

http://theintelhub.com/2012/03/30/cnn-l ... -explodes/

And this is wonderful news.

Sites like EU Referendum and its contempories will grow as the Mockingbird reaps its whirlwind.

I would view these particular measures as Elitist insecurity in the face of Building awareness. People must now move to make the most of this.


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 Post subject: Re: A complete coincidence?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:51 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 3:59 pm
Posts: 401
Congratulations to Richard upon spotting the most important news item of the moment! Although I suspect that petrol and pasties will continue for a while yet.

The last government lost a lot of support because of its obsession with snooping upon the public. By contrast the present coalition, then in opposition, gained favour by appearing to share the concerns of civil liberties campaigners.

However, we now see that this was just window dressing as the real motive for this type of legislation lies outside the grasp of our politicians.

There is a tendency for right of centre thinkers to see civil liberties as a lefty-liberal thing, a subject for cissies. This shows you how stupid they are. And the coalition will use this and any other thing they can find to misrepresent these proposals for yet more unwarranted snooping.

And just to ram the message home, if this proposal becomes law we all, not just Richard, will be on a big list of dangerous people. My advice? Begin the fight back now.


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