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 Post subject: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:00 am 
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Ambrose tells us that the Spanish are revolting (as well as the Greeks), with their new prime minister, Mariano Rajoy, refusing to go down the path of austerity and halve the eight percent budget deficit this year. We are also told that there is near unanimity across the political spectrum that drastic pro-cyclical tightening at this stage is unwarranted and dangerous.

An example is quoted of Josep Borrell, ex-president of the EU parliament. He is said to be the voice of Spain's pro-European establishment, and says such debt-deflation risks pushing the banking system over the edge. "To cut the deficit almost four points in one year would be a true depressionary shock for an anaemic economy, made worse by the requirement for banks to mark their real estate losses to market prices", he avers.

View full article here

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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:54 am 

Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:56 am
Posts: 97
An excellent piece Dr North. In a world of fabricated history Germany has suffered no less than Atlantis. It has taken 11 years of part time research to piece together the truth of the two great Bankster wars: WW1 & WW2. I don't doubt that Germanys' leaders will take and use opportunities to further German interests: Would that our own Bankster owned puppets possess similar loyalty to our nation. But Germany has been maligned unfairly like no other.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:03 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 3:12 pm
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Spain is a basket case but so too is Britain.

Just slightly off and on a tangential subject but one which highlights just how far we've regressed as a society [amongst the hundreds of other examples I could relate].

We haven't had any cuts, yes, the overall rate of increase of government 'investment' has slowed but honestly when you read articles like this - you know we're doomed because with some really bad financial news and events are just around the corner - re- the EZ, we're all going to be in the deep 'doings' and the government won't be able, or won't want to help.
The culture of entitlement in Britain and the idea that 'the government will sort us out'; is now become 'pandemic' [EU nanny state? and isn't the problem the same all over the EU]. Indeed - what happened to the old idea that bringing children into the world WAS going to be a financial 'burden' but that the family was more important and the; 'we'll get by' attitude prevailed and finally how did 'careers' become more important than [the ecstatically wonderful but painful duty of] loving your children??

Social mores and responsibility disappeared, another unintended consequence of the nanny state and Marxist ideology.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:14 am 

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am
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Even if the Germans pass it it will surely be close enough to send a clear message to Merkel that EU banks are second in German minds to their credit rating and their inflation.
Add in a big ECB handout this week and I'd be surprized if it makes it to the end of March.

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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:52 am 
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Ravenscar wrote:
Spain is a basket case but so too is Britain.

Just slightly off and on a tangential subject but one which highlights just how far we've regressed as a society [amongst the hundreds of other examples I could relate].

We haven't had any cuts, yes, the overall rate of increase of government 'investment' has slowed but honestly when you read articles like this - you know we're doomed because with some really bad financial news and events are just around the corner - re- the EZ, we're all going to be in the deep 'doings' and the government won't be able, or won't want to help.
The culture of entitlement in Britain and the idea that 'the government will sort us out'; is now become 'pandemic' [EU nanny state? and isn't the problem the same all over the EU]. Indeed - what happened to the old idea that bringing children into the world WAS going to be a financial 'burden' but that the family was more important and the; 'we'll get by' attitude prevailed and finally how did 'careers' become more important than [the ecstatically wonderful but painful duty of] loving your children??

Social mores and responsibility disappeared, another unintended consequence of the nanny state and Marxist ideology.


I'm no longer sure it's even 'unintended'. . .

In my opinion we are indeed financially as much of a basket case as Spain. I also believe that culturally we outstrip them. I'm no methuselah (quite) but this is not the country that even I was young in.

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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:57 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 4:25 pm
Posts: 1032
There are certainly some hard decisons to be made over the next two months,as Ambrose keeps pointing out, the EU should be a transfer union not a fiscal union or whatever it was "classified" as before the new Merkozy fiscal deal.

Germany has to decide if it wants an euro to act as is should,i.e transfer wealth to the poorer EZ areas like the pound does for the regions of the UK.It either does this or there will be no future for the EZ,and by implication the EU.It really is down to German politicians right now,and it is decision time.Though we see no sign that this is about to happen.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:28 pm 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 3:59 pm
Posts: 401
Spain is an interesting case. I'm old enough to remember travelling there before it joined what we now call the EU. Although scruffy I would not have described it as poor, but then, what is poor? Very self reliant and technically capable it, for example, made its own ships, aircraft,cars and motorcycles. However, 'improvements' brought about by its membership of the great club have coincided with a lot of its industry closing down leaving it less well off.

As you say Spain has done well out of the EU, its political establishment very much so, and some of their cronies too. Now the reason I've got this far was to then go on and ponder the fate of Scotland. But as I flicked back to this site prior to posting I see that Mary Ellen Synon has made a better job of expressing my thoughts. So I'll just say that if over 60% of Scots want that jug-eared idiot Salmond to lead them to the sunny uplands of the EU then so be it. And I think I will live long enough to see it all go wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:38 pm 

Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2010 3:12 pm
Posts: 1441
Quote:
I'm no longer sure it's even 'unintended'. . .

In my opinion we are indeed financially as much of a basket case as Spain. I also believe that culturally we outstrip them. I'm no methuselah (quite) but this is not the country that even I was young in.


Hmm, unintended, quite - I see the point and as to your conclusion - an echo of my own thoughts indeed and well said.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:53 pm 

Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2010 3:50 pm
Posts: 906
German Bundestag doen't know what the vote is about
http://translate.google.com/translate?s ... .bild.html


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:57 pm 

Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2010 3:50 pm
Posts: 906
The trajectory of tragedy

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/guest-pos ... ry-tragedy


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:16 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 10:52 am
Posts: 841
Slightly off topic but today I saw an article in "Der Speigel", the International version saying that Thyssen/Krupp have sold a steelworks in Krefeld to a Finnish outfit who are to close it down. Apparently because of the high cost of energy in Germany. I would imagine energy shortages were in the equation as well with seven nuclear plants closed and the shortage in the recent cold spell. It also said that other large users are worried and looking to move out, aluminium and copper smelters were mentioned specifically. It was linked to by the BBCBias site.


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:20 pm 

Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2007 11:26 am
Posts: 1291
Location: UK
rhaan wrote:
German Bundestag doen't know what the vote is about
http://translate.google.com/translate?s ... .bild.html

Hasn't stopped them approving it 496 to 90


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:20 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 4:25 pm
Posts: 1032
Well quelle surprise,German parliament endorses second Greek bailout meanwhile the fleecing of the taxpayer continues.According to DT Debt Crisis page,........

Quote:
The reason for the timidity is that next week we have another round of the ECB’s long-term refinancing operations (LTRO) to be announced and expectations are for a further boost to liquidity, but uncertainty remains as to how much money will be on offer. The first round of the LTRO proved successful in avoiding a credit crunch and we can expect demand to be high again as investors find the prospect of cheap cash which can be invested in high yielding short-term Spanish and Italian debt too good to be true.


Nice profits for the banks and trebles all round then......and no doubt a they'll be needing a big bonus for all the hard work shuffling that money around too.........bless. PDT_Armataz_01_33


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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:39 pm 
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Quote:
Germany endorses Greek bailout by 496 votes to 90

I'm sure they know something I don't...I cannot believe they are representing the wishes of the German Volk, which is their only job (Of course we know all about that sort of behaviour in our own dear Parliament) or the best interests of the Greeks...eine Wiederumordnung der Liegestühle...schon wieder.
Father forgive them etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Poor little Spain
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:26 pm 

Joined: Wed Dec 08, 2010 4:25 pm
Posts: 1032
permanentexpat wrote:
Quote:
Germany endorses Greek bailout by 496 votes to 90

I'm sure they know something I don't...I cannot believe they are representing the wishes of the German Volk, which is their only job (Of course we know all about that sort of behaviour in our own dear Parliament) or the best interests of the Greeks...eine Wiederumordnung der Liegestühle...schon wieder.
Father forgive them etc.


I must admit I was surprised by the size of that majority,we had beeen led to expect Merkel relying on the opposition parties to scrape a majority.So she has got that through resoundingly.Of course the payback may come later.However we get back to the same problem,which German party would vote anything different currently?Would the FDP present a serious challange on this?.

Seems the Germans voters are stuck with an unified pro EU-bloc in their parliament too.

Ignorant plebs like us are not to be listened to anymore,for we do not know what is in our own interests.It is claimed God gave us a free will to choose our own destiny,which is more than can be said of the European elites.


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