Hot air

RAENORTH · **Posted:** Sat Oct 23, 2010 4:31 pm

Cameron is pledging that he will block the six percent rise in the EU budget which is set to cost us an extra £900 million this year. Can he do that? Well ... the short answer is no. Only the EU parliament can do that. And the long answer? That is here in the consolidated treaties as amended by Lisbon – Article 314.

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SandyRham · **Joined:** Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am **Posts:** 6700

Carswell and Hannan know this is flim-flam.
Is there anything salvageable of the Tory Party??

RAENORTH · **Posted:** Sat Oct 23, 2010 5:39 pm

SandyRham wrote:

Carswell and Hannan know this is flim-flam.
Is there anything salvageable of the Tory Party??

Nope ... and those two will wring their hands, and continue just as before, climbing up each other's backsides.

Wien1938 · **Joined:** Fri Oct 15, 2010 3:16 pm **Posts:** 24

Only if the Conservative Party revolts against its leadership, which is not likely to happen - remember for a start that the 1922 Committee has been neutered.
I will interested to watch to see if Cameron is putting up a show of resistance for the media and MPs. If he isn't I wonder what his reaction will be when he discovers that the EU has effectively seized control over the national finances.

Ravenscar · **Joined:** Sat Oct 23, 2010 3:12 pm **Posts:** 1441

Call me cast iron and sorting out the EU, YEAH RIGHT!!..... a dissonant statement, if ever I heard one...........
More chance of Dave growing a pair, Cameron is a dyed in the wool, fully paid up member of the politburo of Bruxelles (albeit a bell-hop).

Robertm · **Joined:** Sun Aug 29, 2010 8:50 pm **Posts:** 200

If Cameron knows he cannot stop this increase, then why oppose it? If he opposes it and loses he will look a chump. Cameron does not want to look stupid, but by opposing something he cannot stop he loses face and looks stupid. It depends on how he can spin this, but whatever he decides to do he cannot win.

gareth · **Joined:** Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:59 pm **Posts:** 1862

Robertm wrote:

If Cameron knows he cannot stop this increase, then why oppose it? If he opposes it and loses he will look a chump. Cameron does not want to look stupid, but by opposing something he cannot stop he loses face and looks stupid. It depends on how he can spin this, but whatever he decides to do he cannot win.

Cameron is saying he will lead a rebellion. He can only fail to do that if someone beats him to the punch. He is doing just enough to not appear to us to be a Euro-weenie without rocking the boat in Brussels. So long as he sticks to their rules he is not a threat to them but can pretend to be.

A far fetched alternative: Cameron has got wind of plans by Germany and/or France to demand something similar and wants to get in there first.

Richard,

Is Gavin Hewitt correct to suggest that if the 2011 budget is not agreed the 2010 budget gets repeated?

Quote:

The mood in Strasbourg, however, was very different. They agreed to increase the EU budget by 5.9% - almost the same level as proposed by the Commission. There were 92 MEPs who voted in favour of freezing the budget, but 564 supported an increase.

British ministers called it "outrageous". One senior diplomat in Brussels called the decision "nuts". Today one British Liberal Democrat MEP, Chris Davies, said it was plain barmy for the EU to be demanding extra contributions from member countries. David Cameron told the House of Commons in London: "We've called for a cash freeze in the size of the EU budget for 2011 and we're working very hard to make the case across Europe."

Quite a number of countries take the British view, although a majority would settle for an increase of 2.9%. There will now be an attempt to reach a compromise between the Council and the Parliament. If no deal is reached, then the 2010 budget continues. That is favoured by the British, who believe it would be in tune with the spirit of the times.

I would hate to think they have intentionally pencilled in 6% in order to make 3% look agreeable.

RAENORTH · **Posted:** Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:57 pm

gareth wrote:

Is Gavin Hewitt correct to suggest that if the 2011 budget is not agreed the 2010 budget gets repeated?

Yes, sort of. Strictly, for each month the budget is not agreed, one twelfth of the previous year's budget is paid. Meanwhile, the procedure requires the Commission to submit a fresh proposal, which then has to be considered. It is inconceivable that there would be a full year before a new budget is in place.

You also have to take issue with the word "agreed". There does not have to be agreement and, if the parties fail to reach a decision within the timescale, the budget is also deemed to be approved.

archonix · **Posted:** Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:59 pm

gareth wrote:

I would hate to think they have intentionally pencilled in 6% in order to make 3% look agreeable.

Basic law of government department budgets. Double the amount you want and then back down if pushed; that way you get what you want and might get even more if you're lucky.

latipa · **Posted:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 1:20 am

Nicely refreshing looking through some of that treaty text again.

Quote:

Article 311
The Union shall provide itself with the means necessary to attain its objectives and carry through its
policies.

The Council, acting in accordance with a special legislative procedure, shall unanimously and after
consulting the European Parliament adopt a decision laying down the provisions relating to the system of own resources of the Union. In this context it may establish new categories of own resources or
abolish an existing category. That decision shall not enter into force until it is approved by the Member
States in accordance with their respective constitutional requirements.

None dare call it a direct tax. PDT_Armataz_01_07

David Parker · **Posted:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 10:13 am

The coalition seems to have been remarkably quiet about the fact that the Labour MEPs voted in favour of the rise in the EU Parliament budget.

RAENORTH · **Posted:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 10:21 am

David Parker wrote:

The coalition seems to have been remarkably quiet about the fact that the Labour MEPs voted in favour of the rise in the EU Parliament budget.

I think the Lib-Dim Meppies did as well.

SandyRham · **Joined:** Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am **Posts:** 6700

Zey are Meppets, we must drerp a bermb on zem.

Hmmm, MEPpets works on several levels :lol:

Clarence · **Posted:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:37 pm

"The Tories have been indulging in their usual double talk. When they go to Brussels they show the greatest enthusiasm for political union. When they speak in the House of Commons they are most anxious to aver that there is no commitment whatever to any political union."

Hugh Gaitskell, October 1962. They haven't changed in 48 years.

comet · **Joined:** Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:17 pm **Posts:** 1384

More of the old Tory balancing act, talking tough on 'Europe' from time to time to keep their EuroRealist tendency quiet, but having no intention whatsoever of following up. It relies on the audience believing that the other lot are worse and having short memories.

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