Change font size
It is currently Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:08 am


Post a new topicPost a reply Page 1 of 2   [ 19 posts ]
Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 12:12 am 
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am
Posts: 24869
Location: Bradford
Booker, thank goodness, will get slightly more coverage with his column than I did with my post covering the same territory. Certainly, it cannot be said often enough – especially as it is being ignored by the BBC and almost all of the media – that "the world's largest wind farm" opened off the Kent coast last week, is going to cost us £1.2 billion in subsidies over the 20-year working life of this installation. The corrected headline, by the way, reads "billions" and not "millions".

View full article here

_________________
We are a satellite state of the Greater European Empire, ruled by a supreme government in Brussels. We owe this government neither loyalty nor obedience. It is not our government. It is theirs. It is our enemy.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 12:51 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 6:09 pm
Posts: 331
link forwarded to George Osborne, my MP. For what good it will do.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 9:10 am 

Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:06 pm
Posts: 278
Shouldn't that be a 1 Giga-Watt Nuclear power station?


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 9:16 am 
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am
Posts: 24869
Location: Bradford
Ian E wrote:
Shouldn't that be a 1 Giga-Watt Nuclear power station?


Yes!

_________________
We are a satellite state of the Greater European Empire, ruled by a supreme government in Brussels. We owe this government neither loyalty nor obedience. It is not our government. It is theirs. It is our enemy.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 11:25 am 

Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:51 pm
Posts: 238
The owner of the wind-farm is Vattenfall - but who own Vattenfall? Very often, when following money back to its source, it is found that the source has power over the dupes who made the scam possible.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:04 pm 

Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 3:56 pm
Posts: 29
For the Kent windfarm, tracing the owner and the interest is easy. Vattenfall's wholly owned by the Swedish government. We're helping subsidise their energy costs and taxpayers.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:53 pm 
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am
Posts: 24869
Location: Bradford
Atomic Hairdryer wrote:
For the Kent windfarm, tracing the owner and the interest is easy. Vattenfall's wholly owned by the Swedish government. We're helping subsidise their energy costs and taxpayers.


One wonders whether the British government is deliberately committing economic suicide, or whether it is accidental.

_________________
We are a satellite state of the Greater European Empire, ruled by a supreme government in Brussels. We owe this government neither loyalty nor obedience. It is not our government. It is theirs. It is our enemy.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:55 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:11 pm
Posts: 864
Location: The European State of Insanity
If it's deliberate you intriduce conspiracy. I still prefer the idea that it's a bunch of numpties, though I won't rule out civil servants with plans to retire into a part-time directorship of some green energy behemoth.

_________________
Graham Dawson
--
Image
[RN Fan 1A]


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:56 pm 
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:11 am
Posts: 24869
Location: Bradford
archonix wrote:
If it's deliberate you intriduce conspiracy. I still prefer the idea that it's a bunch of numpties, though I won't rule out civil servants with plans to retire into a part-time directorship of some green energy behemoth.



Ministers do quite well ... look at Gummer. He's made a fortune out of greenery.

_________________
We are a satellite state of the Greater European Empire, ruled by a supreme government in Brussels. We owe this government neither loyalty nor obedience. It is not our government. It is theirs. It is our enemy.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 2:57 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:11 pm
Posts: 864
Location: The European State of Insanity
Ministers and civil servants. Okay, maybe it is a conspiracy.

_________________
Graham Dawson
--
Image
[RN Fan 1A]


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:32 pm 

Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:17 pm
Posts: 1384
It's a bit simplistic to see it as a conspiracy, although you can pick out elements of a conspiracy.

The public mood has a dynamic and it can change very fast. The political establishment has a dynamic, but once it's set on a course, it has a lot of inertia. The two interact, and politicians certainly attempt to mould the public mood and on occasion follow it, but it's an uncertain process and can have unintended consequences. Largely, politicians of all parties have more in common with each other than the hoi-polloi - The Westminster Village - The Westminster Bubble - etc. They're somewhat detached and there are few MPs with a technical background. Telling us lies and blagging it out is a common, perfectly acceptable way of dealing with us.

Part of the political world's dynamic is summed up by the phrase "Britain taking the lead in xxxxx". All these things in which they propose Britain should take the lead, cost a lot of money and have a dubious return. Any fool can "take the lead" if it involves shelling out a mint and the return is nebulous. The British political world is quite keen on strutting on the world stage, or at least telling the public that we are taking the lead; we still have after effects from the loss of empire.

Five or ten years back, there was a public appetite to "do something about global warming", that's when the costs weren't realised at all. The political world largely lagged and fully climbed aboard about five years ago when they were all suddenly attempting to appear "greener than thou". It dawned that going green had all sorts of advantages for politicos and other elements of the government and the consequences, if any, would be left for someone else to deal with. Advising caution would have caused a dip in the polls.

It was only a couple of years back that a jury was convinced that activists damaging the Kingsnorth power station were acting in a greater good and let them off.

Now the public mood is changing fast, what with a recession and the realisation that CO2 has at best a very limited effect on climate. The political establishment can't change that fast, for all sorts of reasons; it dawned on them that greenery had all sorts of advantages for them; they live in their own world and are isolated; they'd have to show leadership and take risks rather than go with the flow; there would be problems with Head Office - the EU.

Of course, the role and ambitions of the EU in the anti-CAGW lunacy and the willingness of the UK poitical establishment to take the lead in Europe is an important factor.

There's a growing and dangerous disconnection between conventional politics and the populace.

As a practical measure in stopping the green madness, having the costs, such as the element of our electricity bills used to subsidise alternative energy spelled out on the bills, would be a good start.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 4:49 pm 

Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2010 3:56 pm
Posts: 29
Quote:
One wonders whether the British government is deliberately committing economic suicide, or whether it is accidental.


I suspect a combination of naivety and normal business, with a lump of geopolitics. The last government got sold to. Lack of experience meant reliance on consultants and advisors who were often conflicted. It would be nice to be able to prove conspiracy or fraud because then it'd be easier to get out of this mess. Extricating ourselves from insane decisions like the windfarms would otherwise lead to expensive compensation claims. Extricating ourselves from the Climate Change Act could be more challenging given some of it is to meet EU obligations imposed on us. Similar problem with other crazy policies like recycling quotas and landfill taxes. If we don't meet those targets, the EU will tax us. Of course exiting the EU could save us more money.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:47 pm 

Joined: Tue Apr 11, 2006 9:17 pm
Posts: 1384
Atomic Hairdryer wrote:
Extricating ourselves from insane decisions like the windfarms would otherwise lead to expensive compensation claims. Extricating ourselves from the Climate Change Act could be more challenging given some of it is to meet EU obligations imposed on us. Similar problem with other crazy policies like recycling quotas and landfill taxes. If we don't meet those targets, the EU will tax us. Of course exiting the EU could save us more money.


They seemed to get sold to quite a lot. Consider the various software projects, the costs of which dwarf the Kent Windmills. UK governments haven't done very well negotiating with sharp rogues and government projects can't fail in the same way that commercial projects can. Companies have gone bust because of processor, operating system and database management system projects which failed.

I don't see this government, in essence, being a lot different.

How would a government get us out of this mess? It would take a different sort of government with an entirely different outlook. How do you get the Stork out of the bottle? Maybe a Zen approach. Snap your fingers and it's out. Maybe deal with it the way Alexander the Great dealt with the Gordian Knot and just smash the bottle.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 6:34 pm 

Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2005 10:52 am
Posts: 841
I intend to contact my energy supplier and ask why I am paying a tax to them that is not noted on the bill, let us all do the same with a copy to our MP. OK, it's not much but we have to start somewhere. If I do it they will bin it, if hundreds or better thousands did it someone might wake up.


Top
 Profile E-mail  
 
 Post subject: Re: Shouting out loud
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2010 9:06 pm 
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:30 am
Posts: 3172
Location: portugal/germany
Good idea to insist on itemised billing of course...but I doubt that there's anything that would move an indolent population to reach for a pen & paper.
I strongly favour the Alexandrian solution.
Loved that scene from one of the Indiana Jones films where he is faced with a dancing, contorting & threatening knife-wielder....so he shoots him. (so much simpler)

_________________
Know thine enemy..........The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'
Ronald Reagan.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post a new topicPost a reply Page 1 of 2   [ 19 posts ]
Go to page 1, 2  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
610nm Style by Daniel St. Jules of Gamexe.net