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 Post subject: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:00 am 
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The 300th soldier has died in Afghanistan. It is a totally meaningless figure, which includes non-combat deaths - and bears no historical comparison: medevac and surgical procedures are so much better that many who in previous campaigns would have died now survive. Did you know, for instance, that 371 British soldiers died in the "official" Cyprus emergency in 1956?

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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 5:34 pm 
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What's the point in adding to that?
It's all been said before, many, many times...to no avail.

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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 5:53 pm 
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permanentexpat wrote:
What's the point in adding to that?
It's all been said before, many, many times...to no avail.


You are right ... we just wait for the inevitable. The only real point of interest is how they wrap up the rhetoric to explain why they are leaving.

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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 7:26 pm 
The dead are gone and we can only grieve their passing. It is the wounded we have to look after. No mention from Dave of them in all this, and there are far more wounded than dead.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 7:35 pm 
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Robertm wrote:
The dead are gone and we can only grieve their passing. It is the wounded we have to look after. No mention from Dave of them in all this, and there are far more wounded than dead.


Most people will not grieve for the passing of the dead ... and why should they? They don't know the soldiers any more than they know the far more numerous vicitims of road traffic accidents or the vastly more numerous victims of hospital infections or medical mistakes. To most people, they owe the soldiers nothing - they did not ask them to "invade" Afghanistan, know little about the country and are indifferent to the aims of this government, even if they are aware of them. This is a politicians' war - it has nothing to do with the people. As to the wounded, "we" will not be looking after them - the NHS and the families will be saddled with that responsibility. We just pay the costs, as we pay for everything else the government does.

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We are a satellite state of the Greater European Empire, ruled by a supreme government in Brussels. We owe this government neither loyalty nor obedience. It is not our government. It is theirs. It is our enemy.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Mon Jun 21, 2010 10:38 pm 
Question - Richard

You have given figures about fatalities this month including some non-British fatalities. You have also mentioned another helicopter incident towards the end of your article. How many helicopters have been brought down by 'enemy action' this year ? Just asking.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 1:09 am 
I generally agree with you on many matters. on this I don't so much disagree with you but, rather, think you are pointing at the wrong things.

This is not your fault. The fault lies with those politicos and military who speak in terms of a finite, winnable, war. And because these aforementioned, the public isn't given an honest discussion of what it is all about/ It is about a war that has been going on for 1400 years; a war of muslims against non-muslims; a war that puts the West, Russia, China and India on the same side.

The West, and it should be the World, are in Afghanistan in a civilizational struggle. We deny and easy base for the militant muslims to organize and formtattacks against us. Yes, and we should go after any place where they acrete. What Western politician has the courage to state the obvious? Without understanding this, then Afghan policy is mindless.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 1:58 am 
I'm banging away posting on Afghanistan because I believe the strategy is wrong and we are fighting the wrong war in the wrng place. I don't expect the MoD wait in expectation of my posts for new ideas but if I just lob one lucky post in the right place and it starts someone else thinking of alternatives that would be a success. And even if nobody listens at least I can look myself in the mirror and say I'm trying to stop people being killed. So keep on blogging about the war in Afghanistan because silence is assumed to be consent by those in power.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:14 am 

Joined: Sat Oct 28, 2006 2:47 am
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I ponder: if the security, military and diplomatic establishments all agree, perhaps the opposing opinion is not so ludicrous, after all.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:26 am 
Render unto Ceaser what is Ceaser's. If you write for money then the payer decides on the topic but on your own coin its your call. Write about the things that concern you most. After all this time your instict for the main story is unlikely to be wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:32 am 

Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:12 am
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I'm embarrassed I don't follow you valuable lead and post more on Afghanistan and MOD policy but I simply don't know enough to make a contribution. What I do know is third hand and would only consist of repeating much of what you say. Carry on.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 10:02 am 
Hello Richard,

I know what your friend means about Afghan overload and I sometimes feel it myself, as I did about the EU after the election. But the feeling passes and we need people like you to stop these affairs being buried where the politicians would want them buried, out of the public consciousness.

My own oft-repeated statement is that one day I shall look over the edge of my cloud at the civil war raging down here and I shall be able to say that I did my best. You doubtless think something similar - just don't forget to consider your health.

Regards Ant


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 10:23 am 
It does matter. Very much.


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:27 am 

Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:09 pm
Posts: 429
DP111 wrote:
It does matter. Very much.


I agree with this statement and also that made by Robert of Ottawa. This is a long war, I have already given my opinion on this in a long discussion about the war on this blog. If our political leaders are hoping for a quick war to go home from then they will be disappointed, the war is already in our homes. The war is really a defensive war against Islamic supremacism and we are losing...

Remember Dr North when I pointed out Turkey to you as a threat when we talked about military power and look at their actions now. There is no such thing as extreme or moderate Islam, there is only Islam, when people talk about moderate Muslims you are really talking about people who do not follow their religion fully, remember that. Churchill said this, "They are either at your throat or at your feet." Inshallah, Afghanistan is an Inshallah moment, lose this then they will really be at our throat and yet it is a war we cannot win because we never articulate what the war is really about and Robert got that spot on.

It matters very much, but most people put their head in the sand because it is just too frightening to contemplate...


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 Post subject: Re: Afghanistan thread
PostPosted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 12:08 pm 
That the MSM put a lot of coverage into something does not mean blogs necessarily should. The greatest recent triumph of bloggers over the MSM is that we heavuily reported the climategate emaols & subsequent events - something the MSM conspicuously censored - and it was consopicuous primartly BECAUSE we reported it.

This is not to say anything useful about whether you should report more or less on Afghanistan. If you have something original to say - say it. However heavily they are reporting it unlikely they will say much that is original or useful.


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